FT/TT meeting minutes June 3rd 2013

Meeting Minutes

General

• Moderator: Mark Ostermann
• Secretary: Mario Calderon
• Participants: Colin Rooney, John Agudelo, Mario Calderon, Mark Ostermann, Suman Ravuri, Steven Sackett, Tobias Schöneberg, Teodor Sarca, Trifon Trifonov, Enrique Ruibal, and Victor Perez
• Date / Time: June 3rd, 2013 / 12:00 PM - 2:00 PM GMT

Agenda

1. Selection procedure
2. Revision of contributions (completion of Google Doc)
3. SourceForge (SF) status
4. Setting a deadline
5. Setting up teams, seeking community help
6. Next meeting

Discussion

• A selection procedure was discussed, involving creating an index wiki page with links to other pages containing a template for contributors to fill. Minimal required information includes title, description, and links to existing URLs or documents.
• Revision of contributions is ongoing. The Functional Team's template was considered technical-biased; a more suitable template might be developed over time.
• Release_380LTS was created to link to functionality candidates to be filled by contributors. Decisions about inclusions and release dates will be made in the next meeting.
• SourceForge (SF) status was addressed. SF officials explained missing metadata and history due to a lack of a "default" branch. Decisions regarding this issue will proceed in parallel with the release effort.
• Teams will be set up and community assistance will be sought later in the process.

Next Meeting

• Date / Time: Monday, June 10th, 2013 / 12:00 PM GMT. Attendees were advised to check their local time for accurate participation.

Log

Following is the meeting log

Monday, 3 June 2013
[06:05:35] Mark Ostermann: hello all
[06:06:21] Mark Ostermann: r u ready?
[06:06:47] Mario Calderón: hi Mark
[06:07:11] Victor Perez Juarez: Hi Mark
[06:07:20] Mark Ostermann: hi mario, victor
[06:07:22] Victor Perez Juarez: Hi all
[06:07:30] Teodor Sarca: hi guys
[06:07:33] John Agudelo: hi everyone
[06:08:23] Schöneberg, Tobias (metas.de): hi
[06:10:17] Mario Calderón: do we wait until 15 past?
[06:11:07] Mark Ostermann: anybody from release manager team here allready?
[06:11:34] Mario Calderón: Suman is online
[06:11:37] Mark Ostermann: (cannot see if they are online, because they are not in my contacts yet)
[06:11:41] Mark Ostermann: ah, ok
[06:17:01] Trifon: hi everyone
[06:17:19] Mario Calderón: hi Trifon
[06:17:50] Schöneberg, Tobias (metas.de): hi trifon
[06:19:16] suman ravuri: Hi All
[06:19:18] Victor Perez Juarez: hi Trifon
[06:19:28] Victor Perez Juarez: Hi suman
[06:19:38] suman ravuri: Pradeep may not be joining
[06:20:13] suman ravuri: I will represent both Pradeep and myself
[06:20:19] Mario Calderón: should we start?
[06:20:28] Mark Ostermann: yepp
[06:20:57] Mario Calderón: I suggest this time Mark as Moderator; I can be the secretary
[06:21:08] Mark Ostermann: ok
[06:22:09] Mark Ostermann: any fixed aganda for today?
[06:22:22] Mark Ostermann: or follow ups from last week?
[06:22:59] Mark Ostermann:         Define the release management activities

        Define a deadline to release 3.8.0
[06:23:22] Mark Ostermann: as far as i remember these were the topics to be cleared today
[06:24:44] Mark Ostermann: Contribution List: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1PqNM0p53As4iUcrEo_eGBUtK9YyrhTDL7xiJ_87i_tY/edit
[06:25:39] Mark Ostermann: Software Development Process/ Functional Team/ Template: 

http://www.adempiere.com/Software_Development_Procedure

http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template
[06:25:54] Mark Ostermann: what shall we start with? any suggestions?
[06:26:18] suman ravuri: Finalizing features for 3.8
[06:26:35] suman ravuri: is the topic we can get started
[06:27:31] suman ravuri: [5:55:23 PM] Mark Ostermann: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1PqNM0p53As4iUcrEo_eGBUtK9YyrhTDL7xiJ_87i_tY/edit



<<< in this document,if contributor can paste the link for functional specifcation of feature then it would easy to for review and get started
[06:29:12] Mark Ostermann: i remember we still had to discuss how the work between functional-technical-team and new release manager shall be organised
[06:29:49] Mark Ostermann: because this should be defined in ADempiere Software Development Procedure too
[06:30:36] suman ravuri: yes Agree
[06:31:25] suman ravuri: For me process is simple, FT and TT decides what needs to be there in release and release manager would implement the decisions
[06:32:40] Mark Ostermann: agree, so who will change the wiki doc for this?
[06:33:19] Mark Ostermann: i would suggest to open up a part about release manager there
[06:33:33] suman ravuri: if majority agrees I will do that
[06:33:55] Mark Ostermann: thanks suman +1
[06:34:09] Mark Ostermann: would fit above 4.4 other teams in wiki
[06:34:48] Mark Ostermann: any other opinions?
[06:35:57] Mario Calderón: +1
[06:36:06] Schöneberg, Tobias (metas.de): also agree
[06:36:25] Victor Perez Juarez: I have an question
[06:36:33] John Agudelo: yes , the process should be simple and your execution should be fast
[06:36:47] Victor Perez Juarez: about the Software Development Process/ Functional Team/ Template: 

http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template
[06:37:28] Victor Perez Juarez: I know that contibutor have you information or write a manual for functionality
[06:37:57] Victor Perez Juarez: So then we should write the detail to have this template
[06:37:59] Victor Perez Juarez: ?
[06:39:47] Victor Perez Juarez: for example https://docs.google.com/a/e-evolution.com/folder/d/0B3bIqlUcP8LccElYY25nNkNCMlU/edit?docId=0B3bIqlUcP8LcbExESGRkS2cwREU
[06:39:47] Mark Ostermann: that's one point. we need a doc with needed infos so that ft/ tt can start their work
[06:40:12] Mark Ostermann: if all of this points are needed, we can see after beginning the reviews
[06:40:45] Mark Ostermann: so i would suggest to not be too picky in the beginning about the content of the contributions docs
[06:41:04] Mark Ostermann: and see it more as a possibility to grow and improve
[06:41:14] Mario Calderón: the "problem" for Adaxa and eEvolution in this case is that they would have a huge workload to fulfll it



so the task is how to support them doing it
[06:41:15] suman ravuri: +1 for Mark
[06:41:17] Mark Ostermann: and practice will show what we definitly need
[06:41:42] suman ravuri: as many things piled for 3.8, we need to get started as early as possible
[06:41:56] Mark Ostermann: [14:42:22] suman ravuri: as many things piled for 3.8, we need to get started as early as possible



<<< yes
[06:42:28] suman ravuri: If  majority agrees, we will start voting for one item other item
[06:42:31] Victor Perez Juarez: for example
[06:42:50] Mark Ostermann: so what would we need at least are wiki pages, one per contribution, with a brief description
[06:43:18] Victor Perez Juarez: in my case for forecast management I documented this https://docs.google.com/a/e-evolution.com/document/d/1T1dh2JyncjCMqwlUqnIHEla9tywwHLEqBa2mw1gttEc/edit
[06:43:21] Mario Calderón: exactly
[06:43:26] Mark Ostermann: as much as contributor wants to handle
[06:43:36] Mark Ostermann: and give it to FT/TT for review#
[06:43:51] Mark Ostermann: and FT/ TT can decide if more information is needed for now
[06:43:55] Mark Ostermann: wdyt?
[06:44:02] Mark Ostermann: so we can start quickly
[06:44:14] Mark Ostermann: and get FT/ TT and RM to work
[06:44:31] Mario Calderón: @Victor: this is almost a User Guide!
[06:44:43] Mario Calderón: +1 with me
[06:45:53] Victor Perez Juarez: yes my question that is more valuable create a Concept_Template, or a userd guide
[06:46:17] Victor Perez Juarez: So I preferend that we work in end user guide
[06:46:27] Mark Ostermann: not more or less valuable, just different information
[06:46:27] suman ravuri: Can we document user guide in wiki?
[06:47:09] Victor Perez Juarez: and can provide guia and the must important information that need in Concept_Template
[06:47:31] Mark Ostermann: [14:46:58] Victor Perez Juarez: So I preferend that we work in end user guide



<<< hmm, should also have the informations about if contributions has side effects to other functionalities for example
[06:47:34] Mario Calderón: @Victor: this would be great, but it would take a long time
[06:47:45] Mark Ostermann: and how testing has been done
[06:47:51] Mario Calderón: I would suggest a short description
[06:47:58] suman ravuri: If user guide can be part of wiki, then Concpet template can be extended to have user guide detial as well
[06:48:09] Mark Ostermann: yepp
[06:48:16] Victor Perez Juarez: Mario we shund think that our release should be complete when we have documented each new feature
[06:48:33] Victor Perez Juarez: the problem for me that wiki is not fast tools
[06:48:45] Victor Perez Juarez: becasue not are setup to create documents
[06:49:01] Mario Calderón: I understand
[06:49:15] Mario Calderón: first, the teams have to decide
[06:49:26] Mario Calderón: for that they need some documentation
[06:49:44] Victor Perez Juarez: also it looks very bad.



I have some questions
[06:49:47] Mario Calderón: now we can decide in a "coarse" manner
[06:50:42] Victor Perez Juarez: We should have official documentation of functionality, or will be used documentation contributor?
[06:51:44] Mark Ostermann: agree, and would be great for FT/ TT to have these before review too
[06:52:11] Mark Ostermann: but i would suggest to start with - whatever we can get - now
[06:52:20] Mark Ostermann: and improve with the time
[06:52:47] Mark Ostermann: so that we don't discuss about documentation details now
[06:52:50] Mark Ostermann: time will show
[06:52:55] Mark Ostermann: what is needed
[06:53:01] John Agudelo: may be we can attach files to a wiki page in other format?
[06:53:19] Victor Perez Juarez: is more easy create the document in google doc
[06:53:40] Mark Ostermann: for me it does not matter now if the document is in google docs or wiki
[06:53:55] Mark Ostermann: the FT/ TT must just have access to it
[06:54:11] Mark Ostermann: and after release the whole community must have access to it too
[06:54:30] Mark Ostermann: and even before - for transparency and discussion
[06:54:44] Victor Perez Juarez: ok
[06:54:53] suman ravuri: Do we have any to make google doc accessable to everyone
[06:54:56] suman ravuri: way
[06:55:06] Mario Calderón: so, please, can we reach an agreement?
[06:55:24] Victor Perez Juarez: my doubt is we will use the Adaxa style or Wallking Tree Style
[06:55:48] Mark Ostermann: ?!
[06:56:04] Victor Perez Juarez: I liked me the Wallking Tree , Syle abased in fast articles
[06:56:05] Mark Ostermann: style - document layout/ style?
[06:56:06] Mario Calderón: I suggest we use 

http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template

and attached to it we can put any document or link
[06:56:23] suman ravuri: +1 for Mario
[06:56:38] Mario Calderón: Suman agreed to help creating a page
[06:56:57] Mark Ostermann: [14:56:46] Mario Calderón: I suggest we use 

http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template

and attached to it we can put any document or link



<<< agree +1
[06:56:59] Mario Calderón: for every contribution
[06:57:02] Victor Perez Juarez: for example
[06:57:03] Victor Perez Juarez: http://blogs.walkingtree.in/2013/03/07/seperate-database-for-read-and-write-in-adempiere/
[06:58:18] Victor Perez Juarez: ok about http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template
[06:58:22] Schöneberg, Tobias (metas.de): @mario: +1
[06:58:28] Victor Perez Juarez: exist an complete and real example
[06:59:08] Victor Perez Juarez: I will like see :-) , for until now I never see
[07:00:02] suman ravuri: as majoiry of us agreed for Mario proposal, I suggest we use 

http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template

and attached to it we can put any document or link  let us start voting for features
[07:00:03] Mario Calderón: we -and the community- must help victor, steven and the other contributors filling the template
[07:00:32] Mario Calderón: for the begginign they should have information for us to decide
[07:00:52] Mario Calderón: then it will be filled with more facts, documents etc.
[07:01:07] John Agudelo: it seems long and heavy that template
[07:01:18] Mark Ostermann: [15:00:44] Mario Calderón: we -and the community- must help victor, steven and the other contributors filling the template



<<< 1st step for contributor: open a wiki page for each contribution.
[07:01:47] Mark Ostermann: then put that wiki page in a list for FT/ TT for review
[07:02:11] Mark Ostermann: FT/ TT can answer contributor if further informations are needed
[07:02:39] Victor Perez Juarez: other page
[07:02:44] Mark Ostermann: and contributor can decide to provide informations himself or ask in community for help
[07:02:49] Mark Ostermann: wdyt?
[07:03:13] Mario Calderón: @ Suman, @Mark: as I understood, Suman agreed to create a page for every contribution and the index page?
[07:03:31] Colin Rooney: hi guys just reading to catch up ... a few points I would make.
[07:03:41] Mario Calderón: hi Colin!!
[07:04:26] Colin Rooney: 1. style: rememberthe BYU team were workiung on documentation... I think the style was hte first thing they did.  I proof read the first few chapters but then it dried up
[07:04:36] Victor Perez Juarez: we have https://docs.google.com/a/e-evolution.com/document/d/1PqNM0p53As4iUcrEo_eGBUtK9YyrhTDL7xiJ_87i_tY/edit and this was ad also in wiki
[07:04:41] Colin Rooney: but mybe you could get/use the styles?
[07:04:41] Victor Perez Juarez: we need other page
[07:04:47] Mark Ostermann: [15:03:54] Mario Calderón: @ Suman, @Mark: as I understood, Suman agreed to create a page for every contribution and the index page?



<<< yes, but i believe we need a queue for FT/ TT to work with. a queue which gets filled from contributor (for review by FT/ TT) and gets emptied by FT/ TT as soon as given to Release manager
[07:05:08] Colin Rooney: 2. can any of the libre/open office apps export in wiki format?  I thought I read something along those lines
[07:05:13] Colin Rooney: finally 3.
[07:05:56] Colin Rooney: you could add eCH CONTRIBUTIUON IN THE wiki but my first rection is you should but them in Jira!?
[07:06:15] Colin Rooney: the commits would be make against it right?
[07:06:41] Colin Rooney: and if there are issues or changes it will LL BE IN ONE PLACE
[07:07:59] Teodor Sarca: +1
[07:08:47] John Agudelo: JIRA. good point
[07:10:26] John Agudelo: walking tree should be document each case in JIRA when they are making the integration
[07:10:40] Mario Calderón: @all: can somebody sum up the different proposals so we can vote on it ?
[07:11:00] Mario Calderón: on a concrete proposition?
[07:11:27] Mark Ostermann: hmm, as far as i understood we talked about different requirements now
[07:11:29] Mario Calderón: the moderator?
[07:11:42] Mark Ostermann: JIRA -> FT/ TT review and RM work
[07:11:49] Victor Perez Juarez: my concrete proposistion is :
[07:12:17] Mark Ostermann: Wiki -> Contributions List and Documentation Page with links to other docs
[07:12:20] Mark Ostermann: right?
[07:12:29] Victor Perez Juarez: 1.- Create an document based on http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template, but I hope have the basic information , and this can be completed
[07:13:15] Victor Perez Juarez: 3.- Created the JIRA propouse , that currectly this way I cread the branch name based in jira ticket
[07:13:26] John Agudelo: First: We need documentation about each feature, IMHO every contributor should make a wiki page based in  http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template but we can attach any link or document to complement
[07:15:07] John Agudelo: Second: Create JIRA tickets is funtion of Walking Tree
[07:15:24] Victor Perez Juarez: 3.- We need release an offical userd guild , with an profesional approach , this is not enough, Our wiki is unprofessional and ugly, so in the future we should think of something better, would think near future
[07:16:16] Mark Ostermann: agree victor. FT can decide if the provided user guides are sufficient for release
[07:16:30] suman ravuri: once FT/TT agrees that feature will be part then walkingtree can do that
[07:16:37] Mark Ostermann: yepp
[07:16:46] Mario Calderón: so??
[07:16:52] Mark Ostermann: shall we vote?
[07:16:53] Mario Calderón: I am confused
[07:17:07] Mark Ostermann: ;-)
[07:17:12] Mario Calderón: we must vote, but I don't know on what
[07:18:15] Victor Perez Juarez: My doubt is more focust , if we will release change notes similar to open erp
[07:18:17] Victor Perez Juarez: http://v6.openerp.com/node/1272
[07:18:30] Mark Ostermann: [15:13:09] Victor Perez Juarez: 1.- Create an document based on http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template



<<< 2. Create JIRA Tasks for Software Development Procedure (Dev, TT, FT, RM)
[07:18:34] Victor Perez Juarez: if we want some as open erp , then need content
[07:19:36] Mark Ostermann: agree victor, but FT can decide if the provided user docs is sufficient for release. so we would have this barrier
[07:21:26] Mark Ostermann: so shall we vote for the 1. and 2.? or any other points?
[07:22:12] Colin Rooney: re: Documentation - don't forget those first few chapters created by BYU (Susan ? somebody) perhaps we can get the style template they created?
[07:23:14] Colin Rooney: Susan Grover - was that her? if so I can emai her and ask
[07:23:43] Colin Rooney: I did a lot of reviewing for them but I'm not sure if they ever released the first few chapters
[07:24:04] Colin Rooney: I'll leave the voting to the team - looks like a plan to me though! :)
[07:24:28] Victor Perez Juarez: ok great
[07:24:32] Mark Ostermann: [15:23:54] Colin Rooney: Susan Grover - was that her? if so I can emai her and ask



<<< thanks colin. would be great
[07:24:54] Colin Rooney: Does anybody remember if that was her though?
[07:25:15] Colin Rooney: I guess I can search SF ...
[07:27:02] Mario Calderón: I have a good relation to Joseph Brower, who lead the team
[07:27:56] Mario Calderón: vote?
[07:28:39] suman ravuri: [6:49:09 PM] Mark Ostermann: 1.- Create an document based on http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template



<<< +1
[07:29:17] suman ravuri: [6:49:09 PM] Mark Ostermann: Create JIRA Tasks for Software Development Procedure (Dev, TT, FT, RM)



<<< +1 if Jira setup is already in place, -1 if we need to start setting up now
[07:30:07] Victor Perez Juarez: +1, and Will like see some complete and concrete example Concept_Template, if not exit then we will that make
[07:30:11] Teodor Sarca: [4:30:01 PM] suman ravuri: +1 if Jira setup is already in place, -1 if we need to start setting up now



<<< i've setted up Jira long time ago....
[07:30:31] Mark Ostermann: +1
[07:31:23] suman ravuri: [6:49:09 PM] Mark Ostermann: 2. Create JIRA Tasks for Software Development Procedure (Dev, TT, FT, RM)



<<< +1
[07:31:24] Mario Calderón: and a page listing the contributions
[07:31:44] Mario Calderón: item 1: +1 from me
[07:32:59] John Agudelo: > 1.- Create an document based on http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template

+1
[07:33:16] Teodor Sarca: +1
[07:33:24] Mario Calderón: item 2: +1

but which are the tasks?
[07:34:06] Mark Ostermann: contributions
[07:34:29] Mark Ostermann: probably the contributor can even create the task himself?
[07:34:43] Mario Calderón: perhaps the RM
[07:35:14] Mario Calderón: he assigns it to the contributor?
[07:35:53] suman ravuri: RM may not know the feature upfront, only contributor will know
[07:36:32] suman ravuri: as majoirty of us agree with the process, let us get started with feature reveiw
[07:36:37] Mario Calderón: ok, then contributor creates a task
[07:36:55] Mark Ostermann: +1
[07:37:02] suman ravuri: Victor can you please start propsoing items
[07:37:47] Mark Ostermann: ok, any more to be discussed today?
[07:38:51] Mark Ostermann: a) we have discussed and voted about our process organisation

b) the working process between FT/ TT will be described by suman
[07:39:34] Mario Calderón: when will we decide about the concrete functionality to be integrated and when we will set a deadline?
[07:40:12] Mario Calderón: time is running and we don't have anything concrete
[07:40:21] Mark Ostermann: ... thats FT/ TT job
[07:40:26] suman ravuri: I propose to discuss in current metting itself
[07:40:43] Mark Ostermann: for FT/ TT to start working we need the docs discussed above
[07:41:22] Mark Ostermann: --> so now the contributors should set up the wiki/ docs and proved them to FT/TT
[07:42:01] suman ravuri: if some of the features have wiki, we can disucss them now
[07:42:28] suman ravuri: at least we make them as part of release
[07:42:45] Mark Ostermann: and for release dates: the software development procedure describes fixed dates per year. so i would suggest to find a date we want to start with the next release, and let fixed dates follow after that one. wdyt?
[07:44:16] Mark Ostermann: for example. we could set the next release date to 31.7.13. And the next ones following with 4 months difference.
[07:44:47] Mark Ostermann: what is "finished" until release date gets in the release, whats not finished waits 4 months longer
[07:46:04] Mario Calderón: ok
[07:46:15] suman ravuri: fine
[07:46:38] Mario Calderón: now: deadline for creating a wiki page for every contribution described in https://docs.google.com/document/d/1PqNM0p53As4iUcrEo_eGBUtK9YyrhTDL7xiJ_87i_tY/edit# 

?
[07:46:55] suman ravuri: for next release when do we finalize the list of features?
[07:47:02] Mario Calderón: and then: deadline for finished the description?
[07:47:16] John Agudelo: what is "finished" until release date gets in the release, whats not finished waits 4 months longer

+1
[07:48:35] suman ravuri: this apporach may not help us to lead good results
[07:48:40] Mario Calderón: here, Victor, Steven and the other contributors must tell when they think they can finish a short description of every contribution
[07:48:46] suman ravuri: every one wll be relaxed
[07:48:50] Enrique Ruibal: Hi, I have been catching up with all propositions, just let you know I am here and agree with them
[07:49:04] Mario Calderón: hi Enrique!
[07:49:23] suman ravuri: we need to have good release decent list of features
[07:49:30] suman ravuri: with
[07:49:39] suman ravuri: every time we release
[07:50:08] suman ravuri: my approach is: create a plan and work towards achieving it
[07:51:06] Mark Ostermann: [15:50:48] suman ravuri:  create a plan and work towards achieving it



<<< that would be something like a roadmap for adempiere
[07:51:13] Mark Ostermann: as discussed lat meeting
[07:51:40] Mario Calderón: ok
[07:51:45] Mario Calderón: deadlines?
[07:52:02] Mark Ostermann: ... but featrues should not be fixed to a release date unless agreed by FT/ TT/ RM
[07:53:06] suman ravuri:  [7:22:42 PM] Mark Ostermann: ... but featrues should not be fixed to a release date unless agreed by FT/ TT/ RM

I put it another way, FT and TT should set release date for features
[07:53:21] Mario Calderón: 1.- for the contribs wiki pages to be created? (Suman)

2.- for an index page containing these pages? (Suman)

3.- for the wiki pages to be filled by the contributors with at least some information, enough to make a decision)? (Adaxa, eEvolution, Metas, Walking Tree, etc..)
[07:54:37] Mark Ostermann: [15:53:47] suman ravuri: I put it another way, FT and TT should set release date for features



<<< hmm, nope. why? as soon as the FT/ TT agreed, the feature can be integrated and put into next, coming release
[07:55:13] Victor Perez Juarez: My concern is whether contributors have time to fill in as many formats from a technical point of view, is that this should be, but also want to be realistic, as well as a contributor I prefer to complete a user guide that is sufficiently useful to Wallking Tree understand how it works, finally Wallking Tree could help obtain final document as part of its analysis, of course if Wallking Tree is agree
[07:56:04] Mark Ostermann: ... but walking tree is Release Manager
[07:56:14] Mark Ostermann: and FT/ TT reviews the functionality/ features/ contributions
[07:56:47] Mark Ostermann: (besides this, walking tree guys are invited to participate in FT/ TT too if they would like ;) )
[07:58:01] suman ravuri: :) we will be happy to attend, it helps us to understand better the features that are coming
[07:58:03] Mark Ostermann: [15:54:02] Mario Calderón: 3.- for the wiki pages to be filled by the contributors with at least some information, enough to make a decision)? (Adaxa, eEvolution, Metas, Walking Tree, etc..)



<<< I would suggest that all contributors provide as much as they can until next week monday?
[07:58:22] Mario Calderón: we all agree that the template can contain at the beginning only the necessary information? it must not fill every item?
[07:58:30] Mark Ostermann: yepp
[07:58:30] Victor Perez Juarez: I wonder if Steven will tell to Paul  you have to create a document for each of your contributions, I guess there are good intentions, I do not know if there will be time ;-)
[07:59:35] Mario Calderón: the minimal information would be: 

1.- Title

2.- description

3.- links or uploaded documents
[07:59:48] Mario Calderón: this would be enough
[07:59:58] Mario Calderón: opinions?
[08:00:09] Mark Ostermann: yes, and let FT/ TT start their work then
[08:00:16] Victor Perez Juarez: I do not know if there have time
[08:00:47] Mark Ostermann: [16:00:57] Victor Perez Juarez: I do not know if there have time



<<< so let's start and see ;)
[08:00:48] suman ravuri: let us send request
[08:01:01] suman ravuri: let us see how it turns out
[08:01:58] Enrique Ruibal: I like Mario's proposal of created minimal spaces on the wiki and then derived all related links to it
[08:02:40] Mark Ostermann: any further points to discuss? if not i would like to close this meeting. Next meeting next monday same time?
[08:02:43] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): hi,sorry, got time wrong .. been sitting here for an hour waiting for meeting to start :-(
[08:03:01] Mark Ostermann: hi steven
[08:03:36] Mark Ostermann: oops, we started at 12h gmt
[08:03:45] Mark Ostermann: mario sent an email
[08:04:02] Mark Ostermann: i assumed that 12h gmt would be better for u
[08:04:08] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): it was!
[08:04:13] Mark Ostermann: :-D
[08:04:41] Enrique Ruibal: Why don't we wrap up what we have discussed and agreed so far?
[08:04:47] Mario Calderón: ok
[08:04:51] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): i have read the notes .. will read again tomorrow.
[08:05:52] suman ravuri: Some one will be sharing release notes and action items?
[08:06:03] suman ravuri: sorry minutes of meeting
[08:07:02] Mario Calderón: @Steven: 

Suman will create a wiki page for every contribution listed in https://docs.google.com/document/d/1PqNM0p53As4iUcrEo_eGBUtK9YyrhTDL7xiJ_87i_tY/edit#



Then, every contributor will document it so we decide on next meeting if it is included and start integrating.



The minimal information would be: 

1.- Title

2.- description

3.- links or uploaded documents
[08:08:00] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): ok .. sounds good to me ..
[08:08:22] Enrique Ruibal: On 3) above it will be good to provide a mean of editing/making comments prior to the meeting
[08:08:26] Victor Perez Juarez: I saw an quesrion in document
[08:08:39] Victor Perez Juarez: that we should define
[08:08:49] Victor Perez Juarez: >The question is :

>¿ can we copy features and code from iDempiere project?
[08:09:07] Victor Perez Juarez: I not know how ask
[08:10:03] Victor Perez Juarez: who ask?
[08:10:39] Mario Calderón: @all: is this the summary?
[08:10:41] John Agudelo: I asked that question
[08:11:18] Mark Ostermann: [16:11:20] Mario Calderón: @all: is this the summary?



<<< +1
[08:11:22] Victor Perez Juarez: haa John , I not sure some moment the TT agreement have not take code from Carlos branch
[08:11:33] Victor Perez Juarez: this was to avoid some firewars
[08:11:43] Mark Ostermann: yepp, no code taken from CR
[08:11:49] Mark Ostermann: was agreed by TT/ FT
[08:12:12] Victor Perez Juarez: but I reviewing your code , that they take code other contribution from adempiere
[08:12:19] Victor Perez Juarez: HR payroll
[08:12:33] Victor Perez Juarez: Manufacturing Light from Adaxa
[08:12:48] Victor Perez Juarez: SFAndroid
[08:13:03] Victor Perez Juarez: Fixed Asset from Teo
[08:13:10] John Agudelo: Because he can take adaxa code and another contributors? and can send messages in ADempiere forums?
[08:13:30] Mario Calderón: ok
[08:13:43] Victor Perez Juarez: I not am sure , I think that we have now a lot the contibution that will have first from controbutors before take some from idempier
[08:13:45] Mario Calderón: this is a them for anoter meeting
[08:13:48] Mark Ostermann: [16:12:02] Victor Perez Juarez: I not sure some moment the TT agreement have not take code from Carlos branch



<<< shall we discuss this in next meeting?
[08:13:59] John Agudelo: ok, for another meeting
[08:14:17] Victor Perez Juarez: so they take code from any from adempiere
[08:14:27] Mario Calderón: so
[08:14:33] Victor Perez Juarez: but I think that we need release new version with now have now
[08:14:58] Victor Perez Juarez: then we do not want to say thanks to them we release new version ;-)
[08:15:02] Mark Ostermann: ok, thanks. then i close the official part of this meeting. thanks everybody. see you next week monday  12h gmt again.
[08:15:12] Mario Calderón: @Suman: when will you have created the wiki pages and the index?
[08:15:41] Mario Calderón: I ask the main contributors now: Victor and Steven: do you think you can fill the pages before next meeting?
[08:15:44] suman ravuri: Tomorrow I will create
[08:15:55] suman ravuri: I will share the linl
[08:15:57] suman ravuri: link
[08:15:58] John Agudelo: ok, good bye all
[08:16:15] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): Victor, CR and others asked us if we objected to IDemp using our code .. we said'take it'
[08:16:50] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): I asked LHS about using their zk6 code .. he said  'take it'
[08:19:12] Steven Sackett (Adaxa):  @ I ask ... Steven: do you think you can fill the pages before next meeting?.. will be trying to do write-up .. not sure how detailed it will be.
[08:20:06] Victor Perez Juarez: Steven , the idea is that the contributor need create a http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template
[08:20:09] Victor Perez Juarez: for each contributor
[08:20:33] Victor Perez Juarez: so I ask me if you are agree, or if Paul will have the time for this work
[08:22:18] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): @Victor, because we have pretty good howto guides I am hoping it will provide a lot of the information that would be needed for others to asses the usefulness of the work.  I realise there will be extra work but at moment Paul is committed on other things so I guess it will be me with help from other adaxa.
[08:23:08] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): do you think that will be enough info in the spec?
[08:23:19] Victor Perez Juarez: @Steven, yes this reason my question , becasue  http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template is focus the techinical information
[08:23:34] Victor Perez Juarez: the  need be make for an technical people
[08:23:46] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): that will be a problem for me
[08:24:05] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): looking at the link..
[08:24:44] Victor Perez Juarez: I think that is special Design Considerations
[08:24:54] Mario Calderón: we need not to fill everything
[08:25:08] Mario Calderón: please, stick to
[08:25:22] Mario Calderón: title, description, links or documents
[08:25:44] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): looking in the section called "template" shows that a lot of it is not hard core technical .. have I misunderstood?
[08:25:48] Mario Calderón: if there are addiional information that requires too much work, just leave it
[08:25:55] Victor Perez Juarez: @Steven , so that we should think about the include in future a secction in our user guide to complaint with this information
[08:27:30] Victor Perez Juarez: @Steven , I not sure if Design Considerations is more business approach that technical approach
[08:27:47] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): i will say "refer code!"
[08:28:29] Victor Perez Juarez: :-)
[08:28:33] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): I hope I dont have to write anything about xml migration functionality!
[08:28:33] Mario Calderón: we can modify the template on the way; so it fits
[08:28:56] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): we just gotta start .. we can tidy it up as we go
[08:29:14] Enrique Ruibal: I suggest we change the wiki to provide a much simpler template for contributions
[08:29:18] Mario Calderón: for example, you just write there a short deescription
[08:29:29] Mario Calderón: @Enrique: agree
[08:30:30] Victor Perez Juarez: @Enrique , Will send the document in google doc
[08:30:32] Mario Calderón: so, eEvolution and Adaxa think, they can complete the pages Suman is goig to create so we can discuss and select them on the next meeting?
[08:31:02] Mario Calderón: so we start -at last- with the integration
[08:31:14] Victor Perez Juarez: the wiki is very the wiki is horrible and impractical to document :-)
[08:32:08] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): @ Enrique ... there is one there from CR which I think we used previously .. dont know how different it is from the one with the link above .. but at this stage we will just use the one in the link to get started.  experince will show if it worth changing
[08:33:15] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): @Mario .. yes, will start to document .. will start tomorrow ... slowly
[08:33:40] Enrique Ruibal: @Steven, Mario, Victor: Agree, just wanted to make the point the current templant is not practical
[08:33:53] Enrique Ruibal: I meant "template"
[08:35:04] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): we did one using the CR template .. I doubt it is much different to the 'official' template and it gave us headings to work to and seemed ok.
[08:35:15] Mario Calderón: either can do
[08:35:23] Mario Calderón: the most practical
[08:35:41] Enrique Ruibal: Right, whatever it is that has worked before is fine
[08:36:35] Victor Perez Juarez: @Steven, the http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template   was define
[08:36:51] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): the question I would like feedback on is whether the user documentation with screen shots gives enough info almost by itself.  If it tells you step by step how to use is that not enough?
[08:37:35] Victor Perez Juarez: for the adempiere , I not know that CR Templete , but if I need use I will do  http://www.adempiere.com/Functional_Team#Concept_Template ;-)
[08:37:46] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): will still fill in the headings etc but the bulk of the documentation will be in the user guide .. if others think this is ok.
[08:38:06] Enrique Ruibal: That would be just fine I think
[08:38:34] Victor Perez Juarez: @Steven , it was my question
[08:38:50] Victor Perez Juarez: if is best complete the userd guide and have an single and complete document
[08:39:24] Mario Calderón: I also think this woukd be enough
[08:39:24] Victor Perez Juarez: so in my personal opinin I preferend work in user guide and add the necessary labes from Concept_Template ;-)
[08:39:38] Mario Calderón: ok
[08:39:39] Mario Calderón: so
[08:40:02] Mario Calderón: we must complete this documentation so we decide next week
[08:40:13] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): here is a link to a typical document .. not on the list for inclusion because no one has shown interest
[08:40:13] Mario Calderón: and can start with the integration
[08:40:14] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): https://docs.google.com/folder/d/0B3bIqlUcP8LccElYY25nNkNCMlU/edit?pli=1&docId=0B3bIqlUcP8LcR3FzTTdYZHZFckU
[08:40:46] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): Enrique .. would you look and say whether it would meet your needs to understand the software?
[08:40:52] Victor Perez Juarez: @Steven yes I know
[08:41:05] Victor Perez Juarez: in my case it is my draft https://docs.google.com/a/e-evolution.com/document/d/1T1dh2JyncjCMqwlUqnIHEla9tywwHLEqBa2mw1gttEc/edit
[08:41:38] Victor Perez Juarez: then I think that we should complete this documentation with labes that are in Concept_Template
[08:41:51] Enrique Ruibal: @Steven will be hape to
[08:42:03] Enrique Ruibal: 'happy' :-)
[08:42:42] Victor Perez Juarez: should be sufficient for functional team, if not then our guide did not what sufcientmente good ;-)
[08:43:08] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): @Victor, so in the wiki document we can say in many sections "refer to user documentation"??
[08:44:35] Victor Perez Juarez: similar to SAP documentation, which is very similar to the sum of some labes from Concept_Template  and user guide
[08:45:45] Victor Perez Juarez: @Steven we should anwared the subject the Concept_Template with out userd guide
[08:46:12] Victor Perez Juarez: some way, I not sure if with other names , but should can make
[08:46:35] Victor Perez Juarez: this way the functional should can review
[08:47:09] Mario Calderón: ok
[08:47:20] Mario Calderón: so I think we are finished?
[08:47:28] Mario Calderón: midnight for Steven
[08:47:47] Mario Calderón: time to start working for us in America
[08:48:01] Enrique Ruibal: good night/good day to all
[08:48:12] Mario Calderón: next meeting: Monaday June 10th, 12:00 hours GMT?
[08:48:15] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): ok bye then.
[08:48:21] Colin Rooney:  bye all
[08:48:36] Victor Perez Juarez: Erique have you some SAP document , that have some similar information
[08:48:47] Victor Perez Juarez: I will like review the structure
[08:48:47] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): buye Colin
[08:48:57] Enrique Ruibal: Victor I do, in general SAP user guides are very ugly!
[08:49:15] Enrique Ruibal: I'd much more prefer Steven and your approach
[08:49:16] Victor Perez Juarez: jajajajaja
[08:49:26] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): hehe ... its the software ;-)
[08:49:34] Enrique Ruibal: jajajaja
[08:49:57] Mario Calderón: bye to all!!
[08:50:27] Steven Sackett (Adaxa): yes .. bye
[08:50:28] Mark Ostermann: bye all. cu next week again
[08:50:41] Victor Perez Juarez: othe then the  the user guide should answer the main labes
[08:51:49] Victor Perez Juarez: Overview
[08:51:50] Victor Perez Juarez: Purpose
[08:51:55] Victor Perez Juarez: References
[08:51:59] Victor Perez Juarez: Design Considerations
[08:52:04] Victor Perez Juarez: Glossary
[08:52:08] Victor Perez Juarez: Functional Requirements